# Why Whole Prey.



## SnakeCharmr728 (Jan 15, 2015)

Any kind of cut a human would eat, chicken breast, rib-eye steak, etc is just that, protein. Protein and fat, nothing less, nothing more (other than trace chemical elements and acids).

Organs, bones, marrow, hair, nails, intestines, etc is where the nutrients, vitamins, minerals, amino acids and other good chemical chains are.
All living things are complex chemical machines, water and the stuff listed above are the most important for any life forms development.
Protein is just a building block, carbs provide energy, water facilitates chemical reaction and fiber pushes things through the system.
Vitamins, minerals and nutrients is where the magic happens, especially in reptiles.

So, the idea is, your animal can only feasibly eat so much in a day.
That ground turkey or chicken breast is a big injection of protein and nothing else.
Which is totally fine, as long as its not fed enough to displace the ratio required by the animal to fill it's nutritional needs.
Like when a kid eats to much snack food before dinner and doesn't eat their vegetables.

When feeding whole prey, like rodents, chicks, quail, whole fish, rabbit kits, etc you have everything packed into one little package and equally balanced giving your tegu (or monitor!) the nutrition it needs to thrive. Remember with tegus being omnivores having a variety of healthy fruits in the diet is very important. Fruits help keep a healthy weight, good sheds and the fiber helps the digestive track follow.


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## SnakeCharmr728 (Jan 15, 2015)

new document


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## Jackie & Hellboy (Jan 15, 2015)

Very good post. I agree 100% whole prey + fruit is the way to go. Mine have shown great improvements after making the switch, much more activity and less sluggish behavior, and best of all no more runny stools!!


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## Rebecca Stout (Jan 16, 2015)

This is a great post. And I understand the point .. which is saying "why" whole prey would be good. I understand this is the best way to go .. I mean it's just common sense.

But on the other hand, I really don't understand why some people ONLY feed whole prey and their fruits, (and then put others down that don't). We only have x number of species of whole prey that we buy. It is really bad for any animal, us included, to limit a diet that much. You don't see a tegu in the wild only eating mice, chicks, and fish that are readily available. They eat everything they see virtually. So, for me, I'm a strong believer in variety. Why not both (a mad mixture of everything you can think of with meats, innards, etc AND whole prey)?


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## Jackie & Hellboy (Jan 16, 2015)

Well it's up to us to increase variety, and that starts (to me) with the insect portion of their diet. I feel like in the wild that vertebrates are not consumed as regularly as we feed them in captivity, so they probably rely more on invertebrates for the majority of their prey. Since my tegus are so large that the only insects they pay attention to are grasshoppers and very large hissing cockroaches, I feed more rodent/chicks but I limit their meat intake by giving more fruit, I feel that it is 1. Good for them obviously
And 2. Is great filler for their stomachs to help manage weight gain without having to underfeed them


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## Rebecca Stout (Jan 19, 2015)

Jackie, I could not agree with you more!!! I have often thought about that.


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## spartan103 (Jan 19, 2015)

Ilk try some of these techniques currently bonnie and Clyde eat handmade meatballs of raw turkey fruit and greens all mixed in one with calcium and vitamins mixed in and the occasional pinkie mice. The fuzzy mice are too large at the pet stores around here. I'm gunna try life roaches or hoppers if I can find them


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## Josh (Jan 21, 2015)

For roaches and other insects, I recommend DubiaRoaches.com or RedEarthworms.com - tell them we sent you!


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## SnakeCharmr728 (Jan 21, 2015)

Jackie & Hellboy said:


> Well it's up to us to increase variety, and that starts (to me) with the insect portion of their diet. I feel like in the wild that vertebrates are not consumed as regularly as we feed them in captivity, so they probably rely more on invertebrates for the majority of their prey. Since my tegus are so large that the only insects they pay attention to are grasshoppers and very large hissing cockroaches, I feed more rodent/chicks but I limit their meat intake by giving more fruit, I feel that it is 1. Good for them obviously
> And 2. Is great filler for their stomachs to help manage weight gain without having to underfeed them


Ive never been a fan of feeding hisser roaches to anything other than large black throats and other monitors. The hissers have a hard helmet and I have seen those go undigested and passed even with correct high temps as well as their incredibly sharp legs, cutting the mouths of tegus and making them bleed. I use dubias and orangehead roaches but really like the OH's as they tend to be a bit meatier.


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## Jackie & Hellboy (Jan 21, 2015)

I only put hissers because I tried them a few times because a buddy gave me a dozen for free a few times, I haven't tried orange heads but mine lost interest in dubia for some reason, I have a pretty decent colony of grasshoppers I use for now. I wasn't aware of that about the helmets and cutting thier mouths as I haven't fed them enough to notice but I will buy some OH to try as feeders and if they like them I'll start a colony. Thanks for telling me I was a few weeks from buying some hissers off my buddy to start my own colony.


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## SnakeCharmr728 (Jan 21, 2015)

Jackie & Hellboy said:


> I only put hissers because I tried them a few times because a buddy gave me a dozen for free a few times, I haven't tried orange heads but mine lost interest in dubia for some reason, I have a pretty decent colony of grasshoppers I use for now. I wasn't aware of that about the helmets and cutting thier mouths as I haven't fed them enough to notice but I will buy some OH to try as feeders and if they like them I'll start a colony. Thanks for telling me I was a few weeks from buying some hissers off my buddy to start my own colony.


I was very happy with my purchase of OH's from AaronPauling (google aaron pauling roaches) IF you are in the US.


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## Jackie & Hellboy (Jan 21, 2015)

Awesome thanks


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## SnakeCharmr728 (Jan 21, 2015)

Rebecca Stout said:


> This is a great post. And I understand the point .. which is saying "why" whole prey would be good. I understand this is the best way to go .. I mean it's just common sense.
> 
> But on the other hand, I really don't understand why some people ONLY feed whole prey and their fruits, (and then put others down that don't). We only have x number of species of whole prey that we buy. It is really bad for any animal, us included, to limit a diet that much. You don't see a tegu in the wild only eating mice, chicks, and fish that are readily available. They eat everything they see virtually. So, for me, I'm a strong believer in variety. Why not both (a mad mixture of everything you can think of with meats, innards, etc AND whole prey)?



Thats why I said that any non-whole prey is still perfectly fine to feed but needs to be limited. I never said NO ground meats or organs. Im a firm believer in variety too. I know several keepers who dont offer ground turkey at all. I offer ground turkey, maybe 1-2x a year but offer organs, fish fillets, ground rabbit, duck, venison and goat more often.


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## Jackie & Hellboy (Jan 21, 2015)

Do you buy ground rabbit, duck, venison, and goat online? Is this the kind I've heard of that has organ bone and meat all ground in there or no?


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## SnakeCharmr728 (Jan 21, 2015)

You can buy it online, hare-today sells it but I just get mine from a friend who grinds it herself as she feeds her dogs raw diets. In any ground meats, even if the bones and organs are included in the grind be aware that you cannot compare that to feeding whole prey as the grinding process loses alot of important fluids that help gut flora and aid in digestion. Also when everything is thrown in the grinder and mixed together there is no way to determine what parts you are feeding in equal amounts... one day you may have a batch that is heavy on the muscle meat, while the next is a lot of fat, etc etc.


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## Jackie & Hellboy (Jan 21, 2015)

True, I may try some out of the cost isn't too much. My rodent pro orders last me like 6-7 months at least as it is and my boys like thier fruit a lot (they kind of have a routine, eat a meat item, bath, potty, then gorge on fruit) I've never seen a reptile so excited to see grapes and melon hahah


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## spartan103 (Jan 22, 2015)

Hey y'all is whole carcass ground cavies alright?


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## ophidia (Aug 30, 2016)

I'm just about to try grinding up some frozen/thawed chicks in my meat grinder to see if that works out. If it does, it'll be a nice change of pace from pinkies and dubias for my little girl. It could also be revolting and nightmare fuel-- we'll see what comes out the other end.


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## Walter1 (Aug 30, 2016)

ophidia said:


> I'm just about to try grinding up some frozen/thawed chicks in my meat grinder to see if that works out. If it does, it'll be a nice change of pace from pinkies and dubias for my little girl. It could also be revolting and nightmare fuel-- we'll see what comes out the other end.


Wait! I'm envisioning liquid chicken. How about cutting the chicks into 5-6 pieces when semi thawed, place in a plastic bag in warm water to fully thaw, then feed???


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## ophidia (Aug 30, 2016)

Yeah, I had a moment of clarity and didn't do it. I'll feed them to my snakes instead at this point.


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## Jake lerch (Sep 1, 2016)

Where can i find whole animal ground up for purchase? Any online vendors that will ship?


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## Jake lerch (Sep 1, 2016)

Or...just get some small chicken, quali etc...and crudely chop that up?


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## Brittany Walsh (Feb 27, 2017)

I've been giving my tegu pinky mice since he is young and not very big yet, but pinkies aren't very nutritious? What would my best option be to get him the nutrition he needs? I'm not sure how much better fuzzies are.. any input would be greatly appreciated.


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## Walter1 (Feb 27, 2017)

Brittany Walsh said:


> I've been giving my tegu pinky mice since he is young and not very big yet, but pinkies aren't very nutritious? What would my best option be to get him the nutrition he needs? I'm not sure how much better fuzzies are.. any input would be greatly appreciated.


Dust them HEAVILY in calcium powder.


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## Brittany Walsh (Feb 27, 2017)

Walter1 said:


> Dust them HEAVILY in calcium powder.


I'll do that with the rest I have. I need to get new food soon anyways. Would you recommend me getting something different such as maybe larger mice/rats or quails?


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## Walter1 (Feb 27, 2017)

Brittany Walsh said:


> I'll do that with the rest I have. I need to get new food soon anyways. Would you recommend me getting something different such as maybe larger mice/rats or quails?


How big is the tegu? Can it take hoppers?


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## Brittany Walsh (Feb 27, 2017)

Walter1 said:


> How big is the tegu? Can it take hoppers?


he's about 15 inches.. give or take a few inches... he hasn't really sat still enough for me to get an exact measurement.


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## Walter1 (Feb 27, 2017)

Fuzzies or a while more.


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## HelenaReptile (Mar 23, 2017)

Hi! I feed my adorable little guy mealworms since he's just a few weeks old, but he's beginning to eat pinkies! I agree from the research I've done. My opinion, as a new tegu owner, should not be taken into a great deal of account, though.


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## Tyler 308 (Apr 2, 2017)

Hi all , I have been told not to feed rodents to often because of the hair is this the case , I do give my tegu mice on a regular bassis, thanks for any advice.


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## Tiamat (Dec 19, 2017)

The organs and bones are good supplements to third diet.

Im going to offend the tegu community, but I give my tegus wholr live rodents. Yes, this prey can bite, however, when the tegu shakes, the rodent dies theyre no longer a threat.... that being said my'gu may . But the way i see it, theyre natural predators and they want hunt, not be fed.

Thst being said, my gu's only get this on special occasions. Most of thr time, dinner is of crickets and that ground bison you get at giant (sprinkled with deprivation, of course).

I use bison because its the least processed meat, and 'gues seem to love the stuff.


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## AlphaAlpha (Dec 19, 2017)

Tiamat....I agree with you and once alpha has grown out of his juvenile stage and is starting to slow down I'm thinking of doing the exact same to try encourage some exercise.... Although this is not a certainty as my veiws of care are changing and growing as alpha does.


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## Lovesworth (Jan 1, 2018)

my tegu refuses to eat any whole prey that isnt ground up oof


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## Guman (Jan 29, 2018)

Ok question Reptifiles posted her tegu guide. It had a link to a skink owner who was once a zoo keeper. (Mountian Reptiles) he claims that can dog food without any grains is good for BTS. My question is would this be acceptable as an addition to a tegus diet? In no way am I sugestion exclusively feeding can dog food.


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## VenusAndSaturn (Jan 29, 2018)

Not too sure about tegus... and I somewhat doubt it would be beneficial, though it may be good for weight gain possibly if the tegu needs it. 

My own blue tongue skink ate a wet dog food and cat food mixture along with insects, fruit and other veggies when I first got her for a few months because she needed to put on proper weight as she was on the verge of starvation. Which worked quite well, occasionally I mix in a bit of cat food or dog food once every two weeks as she is still a bit skinny but not starving anymore at least.

My personal opinion for BTS is you could feed dog food, as long as its a good brand. However I prefer a more healthier and natural diet, and my skink seems to enjoy it more too as she gets a chance to hunt her own food.. and try to bite my fingers off during feeding time when I put the food in her enclosure.


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## Iron Soldier91 (Feb 7, 2019)

SnakeCharmr728 said:


> new document


I feed my Tiberius dark meat chicken and chicken gizzards. I prefer not to feed them live prey. The problem of Tegus owner that their captive animal is not getting the exercise they need. Tegus are born to roam and climb. The high protein which ever u feeding the Tegu are not getting process properly. Tegus survive base on its metabolism. Like human are obese because of fattening and high protein they eat and yet they don’t have enough activities for metabolism to strived. Most captive Tegus I have witness from the owners are overly weight. U can feed them what ever you feel you think is right for your Tegus but if it’s not getting the proper activities to roam around or climb and it confined in cage all the time. The Tegu will have health issue. Tegus will eat just almost anything u provided to them. We are the one who decide what they should eat. Remember they are Carnivoure animals. I don’t feed my Tegu live prey. From my experience in the past having a Savanna Monitor. They’re behavior also depends on what u feeding the animal. It is inhumane to feed a captive animal with live prey inside the cage. It would be different if they hunt a live prey out in the forest.


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## Iron Soldier91 (Feb 7, 2019)

U can feed your Tegu not necessary whole prey. That is just another miss conception about feeding captive animal. If you prefer whole prey that good and if u prefer chicken, meat, fruit, veg is that is good too. I don’t personally feed my Tegu live prey just because u don’t know where it came from nor what kind of parasite and deseases may have contracted from other animal or human. It may not be deadly for human but it is for Tegus. Out in the wild is the life of Tegus is different. Their immune to survive out in the wild. But Tegu in captivity is different.


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## Leezard (May 5, 2019)

Rebecca Stout said:


> This is a great post. And I understand the point .. which is saying "why" whole prey would be good. I understand this is the best way to go .. I mean it's just common sense.
> 
> But on the other hand, I really don't understand why some people ONLY feed whole prey and their fruits, (and then put others down that don't). We only have x number of species of whole prey that we buy. It is really bad for any animal, us included, to limit a diet that much. You don't see a tegu in the wild only eating mice, chicks, and fish that are readily available. They eat everything they see virtually. So, for me, I'm a strong believer in variety. Why not both (a mad mixture of everything you can think of with meats, innards, etc AND whole prey)?


Not to mention it takes longer for their digestive tracts to pass hair and fur than any other organ meat. Altogether you want VARIETY not a steady diet of two or three things.


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## Leezard (May 5, 2019)

Tyler 308 said:


> Hi all , I have been told not to feed rodents to often because of the hair is this the case , I do give my tegu mice on a regular bassis, thanks for any advice.


This is true advice, their digestive system takes on average 12 hours longer to digest hair and fur which can cause impaction if fed too frequently without proper conditions.


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