# Anyone using commercially built caging?



## NorCalAl (Mar 31, 2012)

I've looked at Vision, Animal Plastics, Repti-racks and ConstrictorsNW and all will make custom cages (to allow for substrate depth). I'm wondering if anyone has had one built and what you feel might be the pluses and minuses of using the EPVC and like materials. 

I'm talking to both Repti-racks (built in aluminum in that case) and inquired with ConstrictorsNW and Animal Plastics as to cost. In each case, I'm spec'ing a 8' width, 3' depth and 30" high (with 15" below the window line). This would be for an adult (when he gets to that age!) B/W or Red. 

Any feedback here would be greatly appreciated!


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## tegtaker007 (Mar 31, 2012)

i know people who have had visions for years! so they're durable.and it saves you from having to build anything. Personally I'd do it. Its more exspensive, but I'd save up for.


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## tommyboy (Mar 31, 2012)

^^ Visions are nice but I wouldn't recommend it for adult tegus. There is no way to keep the proper depth of substrate in them because the sliding glass doors go down too low.


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## NorCalAl (Mar 31, 2012)

Right - in all the cages I've spec'd, I plan on 12" minimum below the bottom of the windows. My cage would be built to spec. I have a couple Showcase and a couple Vision now, so I investigated each.


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## tommyboy (Mar 31, 2012)

Chris Allen is selling Critter Condos. They hold humidity extremely well. I have heard that they can be altered to accommodate substrate depths. They also come in 8 and 10 foot lengths.
http://www.thecageddragon.com/


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## m3s4 (Mar 31, 2012)

tommyboy said:


> Chris Allen is selling Critter Condos. They hold humidity extremely well. I have heard that they can be altered to accommodate substrate depths. They also come in 8 and 10 foot lengths.
> http://www.thecageddragon.com/



Thank's for the link and heads up on these. 

I took a look at his cages and man, the pricing is very attractive. 

48 x 24 x 18 Standard Condo for 195$? I may be giving him a call this week to set something up. 

Good looking out.


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## tommyboy (Mar 31, 2012)

A good frien bought a couple of these and they are really nice. The price is very attractive as well!


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## james.w (Apr 1, 2012)

Shipping on a vision or critter condo is going to expensive for anything of usable size for an adult tegu. Not sure if the animal plastics would hold up to the substrate weight that a tegu will require. Repti-racks will probably be your best bet, but if their aluminum caging is anything like cages by design, it will be useless. 

Why not just build your own??


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## m3s4 (Apr 1, 2012)

james.w said:


> Shipping on a vision or critter condo is going to expensive for anything of usable size for an adult tegu. Not sure if the animal plastics would hold up to the substrate weight that a tegu will require. Repti-racks will probably be your best bet, but if their aluminum caging is anything like cages by design, it will be useless.
> 
> Why not just build your own??



This is something I've thought about. 

Question is, can a set-up like the "condo" be made for under 195$? 

Price isn't the only consideration, at least not for me. Finding the time to build one and build it correctly is a main part of the equation.


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## james.w (Apr 1, 2012)

You could probably build a 48x24x18 for under $150, but aren't you looking for a 8'. How much is an 8' Critter Condo shipped??


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## Dana C (Apr 1, 2012)

I just checked out Repti Racks....Waaayyyy expensive. The cages before shipping are over $900.

I guess that I was wrong about the $900 plus. a 72x24x18 is $400 plus $158 shipping not including lighting and heat. That would put it in the $650 range.
Here is a thought, buy two 36x25x36 kitchen sink cabinets at Lowes for $105 each. They have solid Oak front. Screw them together to make a 6' long unit. Cut the walls out in the middle and install a 12" lip in out of Oak faced ply wood so hold deep substrate. Make cut outs in the top for lighting and heat or install flouescent fixtures. You will have 4 door which you can cut the center panels out of and using mirror hangers you can 1/4" tempered glass panels and locks to the doors. Put a nice piece of Oak faced ply on the top and you have an attractive furniture grade enclosure. 
Of course you will have seal the heck out of it inside and out. You can also add another 6-12" to the back if you want to if you are a little handy. You will be in it for just over $300. If you want to, you can add additional lowers to extend the length to 7 1/2 or 8'.


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## NorCalAl (Apr 1, 2012)

I'm discussing with Repti-racks now. About $1000 including shipping. That's 8' long, 3' deep and 3.5' high. 18" below the window line for substrate, 2' above. That's for aluminum framed. Pretty reasonable when you think about it. If they live 15 years and you end up replacing your melamine one three times, you'll be close. And at the end, I'll still have this cage. Since I don't need the adult cage now, I can make a few payments and make it very reasonable that way. 

Plus it breaks down for shipping or moving later.


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## james.w (Apr 1, 2012)

I would be concerned with the quality of those cages. I have personally never seen them, bit have seen cages by design's stuff which I believe is similarly built and it is very "flimsy". If possible I would find someone who is using their aluminum caging and ask them what they think about using it to house a tegu with 12"+ of substrate. It would be even better if you could see a cage or two in person.


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## NorCalAl (Apr 1, 2012)

Funny you should mention CagesByDesign. I was introduced to them by some friends who owned cockatoos back when I got my eclectus. I wanted a large cage that would keep bird mess to a minimum and CBD came up. I was not impressed by the cages and CERTAINLY not by the pricing. Outrageous. 

I've been talking to the Repti-racks guys for a year now - though before it was about housing chondros. I've not seen their stuff in person and I would like to do that - just not sure how. Perhaps I can get them to point out a local buyer. You gotta figure they should be at least as good as Vision and lots of folks use those. I've been to three herp shops in my area with tegus in Visions. I'm not saying it's the right way to do things - only that I've seen it done and the cages seem to hold up. If you go to the Repti-racks You Tube channel, you can see some examples of what they've done with the aluminum. One of the PVC (or whatever the plastic is they use) cage designs includes a 5" litter dam below the windows. I don't think the PVC alone would be strong enough in the sizes we are talking, which is why I've asked them to design an aluminum one. I also want it to hold up forever and their design allows you to replace parts. 

Since the weight of the substrate in a cage this size is going to be substantial, I was thinking of buying a used or discard solid core 8x3 door, using that as a base to sit the cage on, and mount heavy duty casters (like six around the outside plus two in the center) for mobility. I've seen doors on CL for pretty cheap. Using real heavy duty quality casters should make this thing mobile.


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## m3s4 (Apr 1, 2012)

james.w said:


> You could probably build a 48x24x18 for under $150, but aren't you looking for a 8'. How much is an 8' Critter Condo shipped??



I'm inquiring about a 60x24x18 and 72x24x18. I'll let you know what the prices are on those with shipping when I get the info.


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## NorCalAl (Apr 1, 2012)

Might be off-topic here, but since I'm the OP, I'll risk it - how long do your melamine enclosures typically last? I know there are vast differences in construction quality, but how long would a well-built one last? And could I get an estimate of weight for a 8x3x3 empty?

Some of the questions brought up here have me looking at the construction. Sentec also makes aluminum framed cages and they have some great shots of their construction on their site. One, which dovetails well with the questions that have been posted here, is about the bracing under the floor. They look to have bracing every five or six inches under the floor - and that's just for snake weight! I've inquired with RR about bracing and weights for their cages.


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## james.w (Apr 1, 2012)

I just watched some of the Repti-Racks aluminum caging videos and they look a lot like the Cages By Design stuff I have seen. I would be very careful before sending them $1000 for one of those. It is not only the bracing on the floor, but the pressure placed on the sides by the substrate will be fairly high as well.

Melamine can last 5+ years if sealed very well and as long as the silicone doesn't get removed by a scratching animal. Plywood sealed with Drylok or FRP will last even longer, and be much lighter.

Sentec does have awesome cages, not sure if they would build anything that would hold enough substrate for a Tegu, and shipping on their cages is outrageous. The shipping is not any fault of theirs, but they ship assembled. If I recall I got a quote for a 72*30*18 and the shipping was over $400, putting the price of the cage over $1000 shipped.


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## laurarfl (Apr 2, 2012)

I'll try to get back...I don't have a lot of time this am. I have one Vison for a small female, and old Neosdeshas for my others. I LOVE the Neodeshas. I bought all of these used and all three work very well for me.

I also have Animal Plastics for my big snakes, bought new. The last big cage is a wooden custom that I bought used.


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## Quartzyellowjacket (Apr 2, 2012)

A Melamine enclosure sounds like a good idea, me and my dad didn't have the time or knowledge to put something that strong together. We settled for plywood and acrylic door that we crafted into a fine looking habitat for $60.


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## NorCalAl (Apr 2, 2012)

James and Dana - 
I've had lots of back and forth and while they keep insisting that it will work, I have some of the same concerns you are bringing up. The panels are only 1/4" and I don't think that's going to stand up to a 15lb male pushing against the middle. The other part that worries me is that the connectors are placed with a mallet - no screws or bolts. So basically a compression fit. Fine if the pressures come in a way that pushes the connection together, not so fine if they come in a way that pushes them apart. I asked about bracing - floor and walls - and brought up the Sentec models. They state they can do the same but the cost goes up. I think I'm going to send a quick note to Sentec. 
In the end, it might be (probably WILL be) cheaper to go to a local welding shop and have them build out the framing, then go to Tap Plastics or wherever and grab some 1/2" XPVC and construct the walls and floor. I was thinking, if I do go that route, that I'd begin the floor with a piece of 1/2 pressure treated plywood, then put the XPVC on it. I'm probably making this harder than it needs to be, but that's part of my charm.
I've seen now a number of the melamine cages and even those made well get torn up pretty good, pretty fast. If 5 years is the lifespan, part of that time is in decay. I'm not trying to knock what anyone else is doing - that's not what I'm saying at all. Everyone has their own wants and needs and resources. Personally, I'm looking for something that will function as well five years from now as it does new. That may or may not be the RR cages. But I'm pretty sure that metal framing and some combo of the pvc panels is going to work.


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## m3s4 (Apr 2, 2012)

I had the day off and was thinking of ordering the condo, then I figured if I can piece everything together for roughly the same price...I'll just build a cage. 

Went down to Home Depot, grabbed (2) 97x48 sheets of melomime and had them cut to specs which are:

6x2x2. $60 for both sheets, cut and ready to assemble. 
Grabbed some screws, plexiglass sheet, hinges for the plexi-glass door(s)
some white caulking, some rubber grommets to fill the holes I drill 
for my light(s) and humidifier cords, a few vents and a NOS energy drink 

Total is just over $150.

The cage is already screwed together. I'm about to fill the gaps with caulk and start working on the door(s). I also have a nice 36"x24" piece of glass I'm trying to incorporate into the build, just don't know how to do it yet.


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## NorCalAl (Apr 2, 2012)

So what do you figure it weighs, all told? I'm not Mr Handy, but I could do that. I'm worried a bit about my construction skills, but also about what things will weigh once completed. 
I hope you'll take a couple shots once you're done and let us see... 

BTW - I just got a quote from another one of the guys I queried about doing this. He stated he would reinforce the heck out of it, then went on to mention how it will be tough using it for a tegu. He's had a couple from what he said. $1200 including shipping (8x3x3 with 12" litter dam).


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## m3s4 (Apr 2, 2012)

Ok so I just got done with the build. It took around 5 hours to complete.

The thing that made it very nice, and made things go much quicker, was the fact Home Depot cut the (2) sheets of wood to specs. Having all the tools necessary helps too.

I don't have a substrate dam installed because this just a large sleeper/feeding/basking cage. My tegus free roam, and although the two juvies can't, it won't be long before they'll be able to with my 5 year old B&W. 

If one, two or all three are determined to hibernate, I'll do something different when the time comes. Other then that, I haven't had issues with hibernation. 

The set-up isn't 100% and I will undoubtedly tweak things here and there - like more vents/UVB light height/furnishings etc...95% done as is. Went with sliding glass as opposed to plexi-glass as well. 

basking spot 108 
cool area 82
humidity is 64% with the humidifier on low.


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## NorCalAl (Apr 3, 2012)

Very nice! You have me re-thinking my future plans...


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## m3s4 (Apr 3, 2012)

If you are somewhat savvy with tools and putting things together, this is a pretty simple build. 

I can't say my enclosure is anywhere near what a professionally built enclosure is, but for the price and the guide I used as a reference, I'm very happy with the end result. Unfortunately, shipping is just too expensive imo for a complete enclosure. Their big, bulky and heavy. I bet mine is 100lbs or very close to it. 

Good luck with whatever you decide to do. 

You might find this guide helpful should you opt to build your own enclosure:

How to build a melamine enclosure for $100


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