# For those looking for Blues



## james.w (May 18, 2011)

Deleted the link because the breeder isn't a member here and can't defend himself from all the negative talk and bashing.


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## entropy (May 19, 2011)

He is proving to be hard to reach.


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## chelvis (May 19, 2011)

I remember this guy, he did buy some impressive animals over the last few years. He wanted to buy my older male but my tegu is my buddy so wasn't up for it.


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## nicklotz (May 22, 2011)

I've pmed and been looking at the board frequently. Nothing still if anyone knows a way to get a hole of him share the info pleeeeaseeeee


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## VARNYARD (May 22, 2011)

Can anyone say quack? This guy claims to have more pure blood in his blues because he got tegus from different people???? How can this be when all of the blues in the US are out of Ron's six. That's right, there were only six blues imported, all of them in the US are out of them six hatchlings. So the claim he is making about getting them from different people is a ploy to pull the wool over your eyes, buyer beware of this cat, and do the reserch on the blues in the US.


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## montana (May 22, 2011)

That was my first thought ... 

Along with that cage give away ...


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## laurarfl (May 22, 2011)

The cage give away guy is just trying to give some incentive for a new website upstart. He thinks it is worthwhile if it drives people to his site. It's no different than any other give away contest really.

I was trying to remember where I had heard of Russ Gurley. I think I have a Tarantula book by him. I wasn't that impressed with it when it arrived.  Kinda weird that he made those statements about tegus from FL and AZ, as if that means anything.


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## VARNYARD (May 23, 2011)

laurarfl said:


> The cage give away guy is just trying to give some incentive for a new website upstart. He thinks it is worthwhile if it drives people to his site. It's no different than any other give away contest really.
> 
> I was trying to remember where I had heard of Russ Gurley. I think I have a Tarantula book by him. I wasn't that impressed with it when it arrived.  Kinda weird that he made those statements about tegus from FL and AZ, as if that means anything.



The Bert book is even worse, the info about some of Bert's work was added by Timo I am guessing. There are things in that book that are not even close to true. Bert was a very close friend of mine for many years, and I can tell you it was nothing but a bunch of bunk about a few things printed in there.

It goes back to what I always say, just because it is in a book, does not make it a fact, you got to weigh it with a grain of salt.


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## chris allen (May 23, 2011)

Man this stuff never ends. One person says blues are b.s., someone else says extremes are b.s.....who cares. If he likes blues, or I like blues, or whoever else why is it such a darn problem? If anyone has such a problem with him, why not invite him here to at least confront him directly. I've seen blues for almost 10 years now, and never have seen a poor example. In fact, I think the structure, temperment, and appearance on all of my blues can rival that of any of the black and whites I have from different sources. So whats the issue? 

Why even have a section here for blues if you are so anti-blue? 

To each his own. 

Chris Allen


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## Bubblz Calhoun (May 23, 2011)

_Everything else aside since its been said and done I don't know how many times. But his own words in his advertisement makes him and his motives suspect and questionable. Just because they came from different States doesn't make it a different bloodline. 

Just like he's offering to ship his babies to who and where ever. Their parents were also acquired the same way. So how does that make the bloodlines diverse?

As for inbreeding in the wild,.. yes it happens. But the ones born with defects and abnormalities that you see in captivity, hardly ever make it to sexual maturity or breed. Nature has it's own way of weeding out the bad seeds that People over look to capitalize on. Which is why there are Healthy inbred populations that live on,.. to sometimes create new species and subspecies._


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## Shadowgamer21 (May 23, 2011)

I don't think the negativity has anything to do with blues. Some people have learned to be wary of vendors of animals, whether it be reptiles or a dog. I recently had a problem here in AZ (just moved here) with these pet stores that are all about dogs. There are several around the Pheonix area. Everything seemed legit, the stores were really clean, the puppies all seemed healthy, they had all these papers for AKC and list of their bloodline, where the breeder was from, warranties/guarantees of every kind. You can tell this dog isn't from a real breeder by the way it acts. A month goes by and we see people picketing the place, saying they are from puppy mills. It's sad but you really cant just trust every person that is selling the animal you are looking for. Excitement about an animal can blind you sometimes. I recommend going with breeders that a lot of people can vouch for or one that you can visit in person.

I meant this as a reply to Chris Allen's post.


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## chris allen (May 23, 2011)

Shadowgamer21 said:


> I don't think the negativity has anything to do with blues. Some people have learned to be wary of vendors of animals, whether it be reptiles or a dog. I recently had a problem here in AZ (just moved here) with these pet stores that are all about dogs. There are several around the Pheonix area. Everything seemed legit, the stores were really clean, the puppies all seemed healthy, they had all these papers for AKC and list of their bloodline, where the breeder was from, warranties/guarantees of every kind. You can tell this dog isn't from a real breeder by the way it acts. A month goes by and we see people picketing the place, saying they are from puppy mills. It's sad but you really cant just trust every person that is selling the animal you are looking for. Excitement about an animal can blind you sometimes. I recommend going with breeders that a lot of people can vouch for or one that you can visit in person.
> 
> I meant this as a reply to Chris Allen's post.l



Ill try to say this politely.....you would have to do some research on all of this especially before trying to compare tegus to dogs or a breeder to a pet store selling dogs. I know first hand just little bits that went into his project and it is nothing less than amazing and something that many of us will never get to do.To add to that... I think what my intent here is, is to just say people should come to their own conclusions and do their own research instead of listening to any one person, any one book, or website...etc. Instead of degrading or putting someone else down try to be supportive. There's bad seeds anywhere you go, but take the time to make your own judgements. 


Shadowgamer21 said:


> I don't think the negativity has anything to do with blues.


How so when bobby's last sentence above says So the claim he is making about getting them from different people is a ploy to pull the wool over your eyes, buyer beware of this cat, and do the reserch on the blues in the US.

I think thats pretty negative towards Russ, and also towards blues.


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## Shadowgamer21 (May 23, 2011)

There's bad seeds anywhere you go, but take the time to make your own judgements.

That's exactly what I was saying. I do not think the people are bashing him, so much as warning other people about a possible scam or animal mill. That doesn't mean that he is or is not. It's just a heads up to look before they leap.


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## AdrianPaul (May 23, 2011)

I think everyone agrees that the fauna post sounds somewhat "fishy", thats why there is discussion here. I also do not like any posts that don't say what the price of the animal is. Its a first sign of a ripoff artist for me.


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## teguboy77 (May 23, 2011)

Wow agree chris allen well said i kinda said something along the same lines before,people tend to follow others words,and never even experienced it first hand for them selfs just my opinion.


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## VARNYARD (May 23, 2011)

I will not support a lie, bottom line, call it what you wish Chris. 


> chris allen: Ill try to say this politely.....you would have to do some research on all of this especially before trying to compare tegus to dogs or a breeder to a pet store selling dogs. I know first hand just little bits that went into his project and it is nothing less than amazing and something that many of us will never get to do. To add to that... I think what my intent here is, is to just say people should come to their own conclusions and do their own research instead of listening to any one person, any one book, or website...etc. Instead of degrading or putting someone else down try to be supportive. There's bad seeds anywhere you go, but take the time to make your own judgements.



Oh, I must have misunderstood you Chris, what you want is for me to turn a blind eye to the truth and just let everyone just find out the truth on their own.


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## laurarfl (May 23, 2011)

I don't know anything about Gurley's tegu breeding project. I do think that his ad seems to claim that buying tegus from different states is part of his anti-inbreeding campaign. Perhaps he didn't intend it to read that way, but that's how it comes across. I just would have like to have seen more detail in his arachnid book. 

I have never owned a blue tegu, but that is mostly due to price and availability rather than the inbreeding issue. He's been around too long (turtles and such) to be a con artist. People either like his tegus or not, and will either buy them or not. The demand for blues is pretty high, so I'm betting he sells out.


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## entropy (May 23, 2011)

He got back to me, fyi. He just said he'd keep me updated, but no pricing info, etc. I'm sure that would depend on how many Tegus he actually hatched anyway.


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## chris allen (May 23, 2011)

Turn a blind eye to what truth, and what lie? 

You know what, I apologize for even posting and cluttering this place up. I should have known better before posting that it was pointless and would get nowhere. 


Shadowgamer21 said:


> There's bad seeds anywhere you go, but take the time to make your own judgements.
> 
> That's exactly what I was saying. I do not think the people are bashing him, so much as warning other people about a possible scam or animal mill. That doesn't mean that he is or is not. It's just a heads up to look before they leap.



Dude.....this guy was called a quack. If thats not bashing I don't know what is. Come on, most people that have been in the herp hobby or industry for awhile either have heard or know his name. Plus it's easy enough to google it. It's not like he just appeared out of thin air.


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## Toby_H (May 24, 2011)

I wish the link was still there so I could review it before posting... 

I think it's fairly well known, as it should be, that only 6 Blue Tegus have ever entered the Pet Trade from the wild... and that all Blue Tegus born in captivity are the inbred results of those offspring...

If I remember correctly from a a couple days ago when I did read his add... he collected many Blues from multiple sources and hand selected a few he chose to breed. This is still inbreeding, which is unavoidable when breedign Blue Tegus... But it appeared to me he is selectively breeding for the 'right' qualities (health & temperment as opposed to color or size).


It seemed to me he is making the best of a bad situation...


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## Bubblz Calhoun (May 24, 2011)

_No bashing here,.. but the link is still posted on fauna. 

I had a Blue,.. would love to and will have another one. Truth be told he could have some top notch blues in his possession. I have read the post I don't know how many times, looked at it from different angles but it comes back the same way. 

He says he has "different Blues from as diverse bloodlines as he could find" and "as diverse a genetic group as possible". 

Like I said before his own words make him and his motives suspect and questionable. Would have been better just to say that he has clutches on the ground that are due soon. There's no shortage of people wanting and looking for Blues,.. there are 3 pages of people who are already interested. So there's no need for the smoke screen and everything extra._


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## james.w (May 24, 2011)

Bubblz Calhoun said:


> _No bashing here,.. but the link is still posted on fauna.
> 
> I had a Blue,.. would love to and will have another one. Truth be told he could have some top notch blues in his possession. I have read the post I don't know how many times, looked at it from different angles but it comes back the same way.
> 
> ...



I don't care either way, but his statements that is quoted here are true. He did find as diverse bloodline as he could and as diverse of a genetic group as possible, maybe they are related but that is what is available. So technically he isn't lying.


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## Bubblz Calhoun (May 24, 2011)

_How? Even if the Originals came in as 3 separate breeding pairs, 2 males + 4 females, 1 male and 5 females or what ever. Their offspring still carry the same genetics and bloodlines there's nothing diverse about it. 

Especially after how ever many years of so many people breeding them in captivity willy nilly and not keeping records. Just because you have a male from Florida and a female from Arizona in no way does that change their genetics or bloodlines. On top of that we don't even know how many from each pairing or clutch survived. Were sold to the public,.. lived to sexual maturity and bred or not. With out a track record either way the gene pool shrinks even more.

Unless someone went on a little excursion over seas,.. and or worked something out,.. and ended up with a little something extra in their baggage or shipment. It's not possible._


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## james.w (May 24, 2011)

What I am saying is, if there are very few to work with and he has all of them (just as an example) he has as diverse of a group as possible (legally). I'm not saying they aren't being inbred, but he found as diverse of a group as he could with what is available.


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## Tensleep (May 24, 2011)

Bubblz Calhoun said:


> _No bashing here,.. but the link is still posted on fauna.
> 
> I had a Blue,.. would love to and will have another one. Truth be told he could have some top notch blues in his possession. I have read the post I don't know how many times, looked at it from different angles but it comes back the same way.
> 
> ...


I think your statement is correct. We are not talking Rocket Science. We are not searching for life on distant planets in this forum. To quote: "There is nothing new under the Sun" truly applies here. If someone says "Here, I have something special, something unique", many will be interested. It incites interest. So perhaps he is promoting his own endeavor, most likely so in my opinion. What difference does it make to any of us? If he has Blues and sells them, so be it. But they are no different than you and I. They are offspring from what was already here, as Bobby said. Remember "There is nothing new under the sun".


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## montana (May 25, 2011)

Send him your money and let us know how it works out for you ...


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## lord_of_darkness (Jun 12, 2011)

hey i want to buy a baby blue Tegu do u know were i could find one i live in Seattle,WA


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## kuroangales (Jun 22, 2011)

http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/forums/showthread.php?t=252834

This is one gorgeous tegu. If I had the money... but I don't so someone else snatch it up!


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## Beasty (Jun 22, 2011)

OK Folks...
Hi! Howaya? Been a while...
I have had personal experience with Russ Gurley. In my experience, he's a nice enough fellow with applicable knowledge of the species. Although all these claims that blues are from 6 lizards, presumably from the same clutch may indeed be true, one cannot fault the man for attempting to do the best he can to diversify in getting them from different sources. Anyone looking to attempt an "Extreme" breeding project, needs to look at themselves before screaming foul here. We all love the animals and hope for the best stock we can get. I personally had some of the finest stock available and was looking to breed. I found myself in a bind I had no way out of to continue my projects. I had to sell off everything that would not fit into my car and move nearly 1900 miles from what had become my home.
At any rate, in selling off my stock, my prized female Blue Tegu, Belle found a home with Mr. Gurley. Gurley had told me of his project and assured me that he had quite the facility in which to house her and sent me a few pictures. Everyone wanted my stock and all tried to beat me down on my higher premium pricing. To this, my reaction was, "You get what you pay for. I have THE best available(if not only available as well) and if you don't want them someone else will, no worries." Having stuck to my guns, I sold Belle for $700 at less than a year old, yet positively sexed as a female. A week of so after having shipped her out, Mr. Gurley asked for my mailing address, as I had been friendly with Bert Langerwerf and he said he had some "information" to share with me. I gave the address and within another week, and autographed copy of "Lizard Man" arrived in my mailbox, free of charge. I'd had no idea he was the co-author of the book about the man that brought the tegu lizards we all love into the pet trade.
Now, I don't know about all you folks, but that doesn't sound like such a suspect kind of person to me. True, he is hard to get hold of, but some people are just that way. His physical address is so far out it takes a special trip for UPS and such to reach him. I would imagine he is somewhat secretive and likes his privacy. I can't blame him there, I'd love a house smack in the middle of at least 5+ acres with no neighbors to speak of myself! On the accuracy of info in the book, I still haven't read it myself, but there are new things discovered ALL THE TIME where reptiles are concerned and even the most devout scientists are found to be mistaken on theories that they had become famous for perpetuating. 
Bottom line: Do ya want a blue tegu or not?! I mean, really?! I personally liked them, possibly somewhat more than the rest(because they didn't fully hibernate and I interacted with them more as a result) but all my babies were awesome. And... that's my 2 cents on the subject.


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## Bubblz Calhoun (Jun 22, 2011)

_Welcome Back Beasty! _


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## Beasty (Jun 22, 2011)

Hi Bubblz!
I see some things have not changed so much around here and some are very much different.
I must say, I did like the old format of the site much better.
I'm still trying to get re-grouped so I may get back to my herps. I miss my pretty kritters!
Hoping to be back at it by next year. I imagine that's the best I'd be able to do at this point but I'm working toward it.


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## chris allen (Jun 22, 2011)

Beasty said:


> OK Folks...
> Hi! Howaya? Been a while...
> I have had personal experience with Russ Gurley. In my experience, he's a nice enough fellow with applicable knowledge of the species. Although all these claims that blues are from 6 lizards, presumably from the same clutch may indeed be true, one cannot fault the man for attempting to do the best he can to diversify in getting them from different sources. Anyone looking to attempt an "Extreme" breeding project, needs to look at themselves before screaming foul here. We all love the animals and hope for the best stock we can get. I personally had some of the finest stock available and was looking to breed. I found myself in a bind I had no way out of to continue my projects. I had to sell off everything that would not fit into my car and move nearly 1900 miles from what had become my home.
> At any rate, in selling off my stock, my prized female Blue Tegu, Belle found a home with Mr. Gurley. Gurley had told me of his project and assured me that he had quite the facility in which to house her and sent me a few pictures. Everyone wanted my stock and all tried to beat me down on my higher premium pricing. To this, my reaction was, "You get what you pay for. I have THE best available(if not only available as well) and if you don't want them someone else will, no worries." Having stuck to my guns, I sold Belle for $700 at less than a year old, yet positively sexed as a female. A week of so after having shipped her out, Mr. Gurley asked for my mailing address, as I had been friendly with Bert Langerwerf and he said he had some "information" to share with me. I gave the address and within another week, and autographed copy of "Lizard Man" arrived in my mailbox, free of charge. I'd had no idea he was the co-author of the book about the man that brought the tegu lizards we all love into the pet trade.
> ...


Too many people are quick to assume, or listen to someone else before researching themselves. It's funny also how people have only heard of this original group of 6 blues and insist there could not be any other blood in the country. Funny how I had a younger blue that came from a pet shop, not knowing it was a blue. Wonder where it came from? Accidents happen, and nobody knows everything that goes on in this country. 
The "extremes" are a great comparison that I have brought up in conversation with others. If anyone wants to continue that line, they will have to be inbred at some point. How many of them were there to start with? 
Good post, and I too had a good transaction with Russ over a year ago, sending him a blue tegu and some beardies.


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## got10 (Jun 22, 2011)

I just bought one (a blue )from a young man on craigslist today. After searching for a reasonably priced one for about two years only to have a certain person end up buying t hem from under me and everyone else then flipping them within 24 hours for twice what they paid. I finally found someone close by and dove headlong into and picked it up. MY FIRST BLUE AND i ALREADY LOVE IT. PIC COMING SOON

BTW I still think there are other blues brought into the country ,JUST like the beardies smuggled out of Australia and the three YELLOW not gold tegus , the fella had in Fla. I wish I had one of those. Stunning animals


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## Bubblz Calhoun (Jun 23, 2011)

_Got10 do you have a link or were there picks of the yellow tegus,..:s I think I missed that?_


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## got10 (Jun 23, 2011)

Bubblz Calhoun said:


> _Got10 do you have a link or were there picks of the yellow tegus,..:s I think I missed that?_



dont have the link but there are pics posted on this site of them also . T.Duseni


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## Kebechet (Jun 23, 2011)

Here's the link to the yellow tegus- beautiful animals http://www.tegutalk.com/showthread.php?tid=6819#axzz1Q2TlMNgS



got10 said:


> Bubblz Calhoun said:
> 
> 
> > _Got10 do you have a link or were there picks of the yellow tegus,..:s I think I missed that?_
> ...


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## Bubblz Calhoun (Jun 23, 2011)

_ Thanks,.. I remember those_


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## got10 (Jun 23, 2011)

I just saw someone selling "Yellow tegus" ,When i looked into the add it was just a gold tegu . What a bunch of bull hocky


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## VARNYARD (Jul 6, 2011)

Chris, your boy is a liar, that much I know is a fact, he is off on another forum talking smack right now, just more lies, just like his book. The (want a be needs) to get a life and he needs to really start stating facts, fiction don't hold much water with me, like his joke of a book.

As for the Extremes, that is not a problem, I will not even sell a related pair, bottom line.


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## Reptifam (Jul 16, 2011)

woah bobby, lets calm down with the slandering of other breeders. He's trying to do the same thing you are, so be respectful.


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## TegusRawsome80 (Jul 16, 2011)

Reptifam said:


> woah bobby, lets calm down with the slandering of other breeders. He's trying to do the same thing you are, so be respectful.


Yeah Bobby, I respect you as a breeder but the bottom line is he has something you don't and you seem to have a problem with it. I have seen the extra stock that he sold off, which I am assuming wasn't his best, and they were some damn nice looking animals. Your extremes have what maybe 2 unrelated bloodlines? Eventually you are going to have to cross those bloodlines and it will all come downhill from there. If not you are just breeding the same bloodline over and over again. The cycle can't continue forever. I saw a WC blue for sale from some random store in Arizona one time, yet I'm sure that wasn't new blood or anything. You may have some bone to pick yet you say that he is going around talking smack on a forum. Exactly what are you doing then? You attacked him for his ad on one forum and he came back on another. What did you expect?


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## Josh (Jul 16, 2011)

Let's not bicker or be disrespectful - any of us. We can discuss the facts with civility or we'll have to close the thread. Keep it friendly please


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## Reptifam (Jul 16, 2011)

TegusRawsome80 said:


> Reptifam said:
> 
> 
> > woah bobby, lets calm down with the slandering of other breeders. He's trying to do the same thing you are, so be respectful.
> ...



word brotha!


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## teguboy77 (Jul 16, 2011)

Not trying to take sides but the rules should apply to everyone not certain people,cause some people can talk crap and when others do it then its no good.You have to give respect to get it bottom line as stated before were here to help and learn not to talk people down or be disrespectful to anybody no matter,WHO YOU ARE,race,religion,etc.:-/


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## reptastic (Jul 16, 2011)

IMO theres a slight difference in bobbys giants and the blues, he has kept tracks of his giants linage and when you buy one you know wehther you can breed them or not, wereas the blues were just bred and no one kept records therefore inbreeding occured, so bobby is justified in defending his giants vs. The blues, lets keep this civilized guys


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## teguboy77 (Jul 17, 2011)

As far as bobby giants go i could be wrong but i know this for a fact bobby got some of his giants from Ben siegel's reptiles as this is what he told me on the phone some years back,so really he started breeding them and who knows if any of the parents are related,and this was what bobby had told me on the phone,and i'm thinking as he started breeding them he kept track of the blood lines he breed,but hes not 100% sure if the origanal adults he got off ben are related.Blues from what i heard the whole story that there were six blues that were brought over here that started blues being breed,that dont mean there isnt healthy blues or a breeder that breeds blues doesnt have good bloodlines, and this to is hear say right?Why do certain breeders hat on other breeders that breed just like them and sell healthy lizards i dont get it.As long as the breeder is not breeding the same bloodlines together and are keeping track of there blue bloodlines then good for them damn do you and other breeders stop hating.:-/


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## VARNYARD (Jul 17, 2011)

I am not going to stay on this thread as I really don't have the time to hash out nothing but pure garbage.

I will say this, I don't like lies told about me, do you? I also don't like lies told about a very close friend of mine that passed away, would you like it if it happen to you?

And he will never be like me, not even close, enough said.


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