# Please help! She’s issue possible scale rot



## trashboat69 (Feb 18, 2020)

My argentine red is having issues shedding, noticed recently it looks like some of his skin is cracking and possibly scabbing ? I am worried it might be scale rot. Our vet isn’t able to see him until next Tuesday a week from today, I am just super worried about him and wondering if there is anything I can do in the mean time to help him out since he has to wait an entire week


----------



## trashboat69 (Feb 18, 2020)

here Are some pictures of what he’s looking like right now it seems to be spreading .. does this look like scale rot to you guys ? Please help I don’t know what to do he’s never had a shed issue like this until now


----------



## AlphaAlpha (Feb 18, 2020)

Firstly Scale Rot is a generalised saying for any kind of skin/scale problem.

He looks very dry and like there's a few layers of thin flaking skin build up to me..... Improve humidity in his hide, bath regularly, feed some fish/cod liver oil...... some people also suggest moisturising with coconut oil and I'd get some Neosporin for in case any splits too deep and starts weeping.

I'd also keep your app but I'd be prepared to see improvement before then.


----------



## Walter1 (Feb 18, 2020)

That, Oh add moust sohagnum to humidify the hide. Sphagnum has strong antiseptic qualities.


----------



## trashboat69 (Feb 18, 2020)

AlphaAlpha said:


> Firstly Scale Rot is a generalised saying for any kind of skin/scale problem.
> 
> He looks very dry and like there's a few layers of thin flaking skin build up to me..... Improve humidity in his hide, bath regularly, feed some fish/cod liver oil...... some people also suggest moisturising with coconut oil and I'd get some Neosporin for in case any splits too deep and starts weeping.
> 
> I'd also keep your app but I'd be prepared to see improvement before then.



So actually I’ve been doing all of this Except for the neosporin and he’s been getting worse that’s why I’m worried if there’s something Serously wrong with him bc it is not budging


----------



## mdeford09 (Feb 18, 2020)

I hate to be the bearer of bad news but, that is absolutely many layers of skin. I see at least 3. And, you can even see how tightly he cramped inside all that old skin. If it's not removed, he will die from it and, it is reaching the point of no return. He doesn't look good. He's been kept at very low humidity for a long while. That causes dehydration, skin issues, shed issues, and just an all around miserable tegu. And, the all extra skin affects UV absorption so he likely has a calcium deficiency. 

Your best bet is going to be bathing him multiple times daily, keep the humidity in the tank above 80%, and do not pull it off by hand you will peel off scales and live skin if you do. You can get the already loose flakes off with scissors, if they're a bother. But, your best bet is to just let him scrape it off on his own. He knows when it hurts, you don't. Make sure he has rough surface to rub his stomach and sides against. I just use large square walking stones home depot. Also, while I do not usually recommend this, I think it is needed here. Lotion. Scent and dye free. cocoa butter is a good option. Every night before bed and right after he wakes up, coat him in a thick layer. It will also help soften the old skin. After an hour, give him his first bath.... WARNING! the lotion is going to help with cosmetic issues so he will look better rather quickly BUT, he still needs to drop the skin so don't stop even if he looks a little better.

Oh, and definitely buy Neosporin without any pain reliever added. (I had to buy from amazon. All of the stores around me only carried the pain reliever kind and it's harmful to your reptile). It is a MUST with reptiles. It is antibacterial and provides a layer of protection from anything new getting into the wound.

However, a professional (vet) is a likely a requirement here as they likely have a lot more time to provide the of care he needs. I work 8hrs a day so there is no way I would be able to provide that kind of intense care. I would need to take him to the vet. Hopefully you can make him comfortable and happier, maybe even get rid of the issue by the time your vet is free.

Definitely invest in a humidifier and keep it blowing into his cage. Mine uses 1 gallon of water and on low, lasts 2.5 days. However, I bought a cheap timer off of amazon and I have mine kick on for 30min a day, 9x per day (once ever 2.5ish hours). My water lasts a week and their humidity is constantly above 75%.


----------



## trashboat69 (Feb 18, 2020)

Here’s what I’ve been doing for him so far 

so for in his enclosure he has a mix of eco earth coco fiber and spaghnum peat moss, he has a humid hide filled with spaghnum, a humidifier, tank is misted regularly, uvb and heat lamps. He’s still eating well food is always dusted with calcium without d3 and cod oil, and getting baths daily since this happened 

I have added coconut oil to his baths but I’ve made sure he didn’t have any still on him when going back into his tank so he doesn’t get burns, coconut oil didn’t seem to do much, and I’ve tried yesterday giving him a iodine betadine bath to clean his skin with some water based anteseptic after


----------



## mdeford09 (Feb 18, 2020)

The basic care sounds about right but, it really depends on the overall tank humidity, not just his hide. They really need 60% or more always. Even while basking. (it's the only big downside Tegus have. Dry areas are harsh on them. Stuck shed results in the loss of tails and fingers and all sort of issues)

I am not really sure what adding coconut oil to the bath would do since the oil doesn't mix with water. You would be better off coating him with coconut oil and then rinse it off by running 90F water over him multiple times. Then let him roam his humid tank for an hour with no basking. Rinsing with warm water will never get rid of all of it and by doing this, it will have time to work the moisture in. But, I don't think this is really any better than adding lotion. That's essentially what the coco oil is acting as. That said, you are more than welcome to use coconut oil in place of the lotion. It will work just as good, I am sure.

You're not likely going to clean the skin(or are you refuring to cleaning the newly exposed areas?). All that skin your seeing is old stuck skin so it's just going to look rough. Reminds me of the first shed after brumation (besides the multiple layers of skin). The first shed after brumation is much thicker and uglier than normal due to them being buried in dirt for 2-6 months... What you're really trying for, is the skin to be removed. I wouldn't wash or scrub anything. Just let him soak 4-5x a day for 20min or more.

He's going to need lots of moisture to loosen it all up.


----------



## AlphaAlpha (Feb 18, 2020)

Also try to shower him ....... Alpha loves to be showered and I think the pressure of water (not on full) helps break through cracked old skin and obviously helps with shed issues peeling it off.


----------



## mdeford09 (Feb 18, 2020)

I second the shower if he will tolerate it. It will also help to remove any excess coconut oil.


----------



## trashboat69 (Feb 18, 2020)

My concern was that shed on his side, it doesn’t feel like normal skin it is so rough almost feels like a scab that’s why I was cleaning it. He actually loves showers I’m gunna have to try the shower thing but with the sink, currently out of a shower bc bathroom is being remodeled :/


----------



## trashboat69 (Feb 18, 2020)

Also I just gave him another bath his back is shedding great more of that skin came off But what’s weird is the skin under neath that doesn’t look like it has shed on it like the rest of him.


----------



## mdeford09 (Feb 18, 2020)

Did he go through brumation?


----------



## mdeford09 (Feb 18, 2020)

The reason I ask is my very first thought was it was brumation shed. What made me say it isn't, is the multiple layers of skin on his side. 

But, I am wondering if this isn't just brumation shed with another layer under it.


----------



## trashboat69 (Feb 18, 2020)

mdeford09 said:


> The reason I ask is my very first thought was it was brumation shed. What made me say it isn't, is the multiple layers of skin on his side.
> 
> But, I am wondering if this isn't just brumation shed with another layer under it.




He definitely slowed down a bit for this winter but didn’t fully Brumate, but it def does look like a brumation shed I just don’t understand the layers of skin only on his sides ethier and why on his back it’s fresh skin under neath 

I just called the vet back I have to drop him off on Thursday and they are going to squeeze him in when they can that day i don’t want him waiting until next week


----------



## mdeford09 (Feb 18, 2020)

He doesn't look super old, 12-18 months tops so, I would guess it was first attempt. It's not uncommon for babies to not brumate the first season. Your temps and lighting probably kept him from going fully down. Which isn't a problem as far as I am aware. However, if what I am about to say ends up being true, it will definitely mean brumation skipping could be a problem.



This just a hypothesis but, it actually makes really good sense.....

I think what is going on is, that it definitely is his brumation shed/skin. But, since he didn't go down and kept eating, he outgrew it. Now he's in a situation where it's not ready to come off even though it's bursting at the seams. And, due to how tough that skin is, it's causing him harm as it is forcibly ripped off. And, I think the extra _layers_ of skin are actually living skin that was pulled off when the thicker brumation skin burst and ripped.

However, I want make it clear that I have no experience with this and have never heard of it happening before. Logically it makes sense. He wanted to go down, his body mostly prepared, including the thick skin growth, but he never went down. Then he ate and outgrew that skin. Right now is the time of year that most are starting to wakeup and they will keep that shed for a while after waking up. So it is very likely he would still have his if he got far enough into brumation to grow it.


----------



## Walter1 (Feb 18, 2020)

mdeford09 said:


> He doesn't look super old, 12-18 months tops so, I would guess it was first attempt. It's not uncommon for babies to not brumate the first season. Your temps and lighting probably kept him from going fully down. Which isn't a problem as far as I am aware. However, if what I am about to say ends up being true, it will definitely mean brumation skipping could be a problem.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


An interesting and testable hypothesis.


----------



## mdeford09 (Feb 18, 2020)

Walter1 said:


> An interesting and testable hypothesis.



Yeah, like I said, it makes sense logically. That said, I am not sure how to test it.

Let your tegu go into brumation and then wake him up after a month and not let him go back down..??.. Then get him to start eating a bunch and see if he bursts..??.. (I can't help but feel it would be very stressful and borderline animal abuse... certainly isn't something I want to test on one of the boys I have).


----------



## Walter1 (Feb 18, 2020)

mdeford09 said:


> Yeah, like I said, it makes sense logically. That said, I am not sure how to test it.
> 
> Let your tegu go into brumation and then wake him up after a month and not let him go back down..??.. Then get him to start eating a bunch and see if he bursts..??.. (I can't help but feel it would be very stressful and borderline animal abuse... certainly isn't something I want to test on one of the boys I have).


When I say testable, I mean it can be tested. I would not. Rather, encourage three to four months of down time and work with them thereafter. The rest is important to them. 

Perhaps, inbreeding and crossbreedung have dampened it, but argies need to rest, even if just a prolonged slow down.


----------



## trashboat69 (Feb 18, 2020)

mdeford09 said:


> He doesn't look super old, 12-18 months tops so, I would guess it was first attempt. It's not uncommon for babies to not brumate the first season. Your temps and lighting probably kept him from going fully down. Which isn't a problem as far as I am aware. However, if what I am about to say ends up being true, it will definitely mean brumation skipping could be a problem.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




That actually would make a lot of sense if that’s what happened.. I should ask the vet what they think about that. I just hope he gets better trying everything I can until his appointment /:


----------



## mdeford09 (Feb 19, 2020)

Walter1 said:


> When I say testable, I mean it can be tested. I would not. Rather, encourage three to four months of down time and work with them thereafter. The rest is important to them.
> 
> Perhaps, inbreeding and crossbreedung have dampened it, but argies need to rest, even if just a prolonged slow down.



I am right there with you. We always just let them go down. It gives us a break, saves us money, and it's what they naturally do. So we just let them do it.

However, I do see lots of folks claiming that they have kept theirs awake multiple seasons and they don't have issues with it. It could be legit or, it could be BS and their Tegu is about to crash like a plant.... Plants that require a winter dormancy will last 2-5 seasons without it and even seem to be thriving great at first because they didn't lose their last growth over winter but, they will eventually run out of steam and die... I definitely prefer to mimic their natural environment verses introducing my own idea of what they need.




trashboat69 said:


> That actually would make a lot of sense if that’s what happened.. I should ask the vet what they think about that. I just hope he gets better trying everything I can until his appointment /:



Definitely ask the vet.

Like I said, it's not something I have ever heard before with any reptile but, I don't own any other reptile that goes through brumation but has skipped it. Really, it's just our Tegus and Blue Tongues that go through brumation and they do it without a problem each winter... Well, our Suriname giant marine toads will brumate if I let them get too cold but, it's not something they do in the wild. It's just a survival attempt if the temps randomly drop too low.

I really hope he gets through it and is not scarred too bad (mentally and physically) These sorts of things are really are saddening because you feel so helpless. And, personally, I hate seeing my tegus in any sort of discomfort. They're so smart, I know they have a decent idea of what is happening and they absolutely feel the pain.

Keep us updated with posts and pics.


----------



## trashboat69 (Feb 19, 2020)

mdeford09 said:


> I am right there with you. We always just let them go down. It gives us a break, saves us money, and it's what they naturally do. So we just let them do it.
> 
> However, I do see lots of folks claiming that they have kept theirs awake multiple seasons and they don't have issues with it. It could be legit or, it could be BS and their Tegu is about to crash like a plant.... Plants that require a winter dormancy will last 2-5 seasons without it and even seem to be thriving great at first because they didn't lose their last growth over winter but, they will eventually run out of steam and die... I definitely prefer to mimic their natural environment verses introducing my own idea of what they need.
> 
> ...



it is weird Why he wouldn’t brumate, all my others do it no problem it is just him. He didn’t brumate last year ethier but he was very young then...

but I have some very good news! Ive been. Giving him several baths a day and upped his humidity to about 85 and the skin, the second layer, is coming off a bit. ANDD there are only two layers not multiple ! It looks like one very thick layer for brumation shed and only one layer underneath. It was part of the really bad spot that started coming off and fresh skin is showing thankfully and it looks healthy. I will take a picture when he gets out of his bath and I will update you guys tomorrow after his vet visit hoping everything turns out okay for my little guy !


----------



## trashboat69 (Feb 19, 2020)

It’s a start atleast


----------



## mdeford09 (Feb 20, 2020)

Oh good! That's great to hear. And yes, that definitely looks like thick brumation shed. It's thick and more leathery in appearance. 

Keep it up and before long, it will all be off!


----------



## Walter1 (Feb 20, 2020)

He's on his way out of it.


----------



## trashboat69 (Feb 21, 2020)

Great news vet figured out what was wrong with my guy and he’s gunna be just fine 

so first, it was a brumation shed that thick layer, still not sure why he didn’t brumate she said she likes everything about his tank set up and temps humidity I had she said everything sounded great. Just gunna have to keep an eye on him next year and make sure he fully goes down. But that shed will come off it’s already budging a lot more just gunna keep soaking and he will be good with that. 

So for the bad spots, he has a bacterial infection on those scales that looked gross. He obv gained a little bit of weight from still eating a little bit and slowing down over the winter. Water was getting trapped in those spots from him gaining that weight and caused some bacteria to grow 

she gave me medicine to spray on those spots should clear it up fast and it’s also gunna help his shed come off in those tough spots, it already looks/ feels a lot better and more skin is coming off ! He’s going back in two weeks to make sure everything works properly for him. Thank you for your help everyone much appreciated!


----------



## Walter1 (Feb 21, 2020)

Nice going. Glad you're past high center ground with it.


----------



## AlphaAlpha (Feb 23, 2020)

Nice to hear you got it under control and are on the mend


----------



## mdeford09 (Feb 24, 2020)

That's fantastic to hear! Hopefully he makes a full recovery.


----------



## Debita (Feb 26, 2020)

Just read this whole thing - very interesting info. The one thing (pretty sure it was mentioned) that shouldn't be forgotten is the addition of fish oil in his food. "People" that have dry skin aren't getting enough oil, and some mistake the problem by only applying a topical fix. It's not fixing the source. I think it's the same with animals that are now housed and contained, and don't get their natural fish oil and fat from animals that they would naturally hunt for. Hard for us owners sometimes to give that complete diet that they need to stay healthy.

Also - these changes that you're working on take a long time. It doesn't get cured quickly, rather small improvements should be observed, and acted upon. Phew! Good luck and keep us updated.


----------



## BucknerCrestExotics (Feb 26, 2020)

Go to this video 



 this helped with my tegus stuck shed but mine wasn't that bad but just a consideration with everyone elses advice


----------



## Walter1 (Feb 26, 2020)

Debita said:


> Just read this whole thing - very interesting info. The one thing (pretty sure it was mentioned) that shouldn't be forgotten is the addition of fish oil in his food. "People" that have dry skin aren't getting enough oil, and some mistake the problem by only applying a topical fix. It's not fixing the source. I think it's the same with animals that are now housed and contained, and don't get their natural fish oil and fat from animals that they would naturally hunt for. Hard for us owners sometimes to give that complete diet that they need to stay healthy.
> 
> Also - these changes that you're working on take a long time. It doesn't get cured quickly, rather small improvements should be observed, and acted upon. Phew! Good luck and keep us updated.


I agree, this has been a very instructive thread that touched on several points relating to nutrition and remedy.


----------



## trashboat69 (Apr 6, 2020)

Walter1 said:


> I agree, this has been a very instructive thread that touched on several points relating to nutrition and remedy.



Hey thought I would post an update since it’s been a little bit. But all layers of my tegus shed came off very nicely thankfully this is almost done  all that’s left is he has one thin line of scab left on his side you can see on the picture even that is starting to come off it’s healing up that was the really bad patch 

But he’s been eating good lots of energy and doing great happy everything worked out for my little guy just glad that skin came off finally. Thank you for the help everyone


----------



## Debita (Apr 6, 2020)

Looks good to me!! Another good outcome. Great news

I'm going to try the B-12 complex for my male that is having a tough tail shed. Thanks for the video - the guy was very easy going and helpful.


----------



## Guman (Apr 12, 2020)

Walter1 said:


> An interesting and testable hypothesis.


Interesting hypothesis, but my gu has never gone down in the winter.


----------



## Walter1 (Apr 12, 2020)

Guman said:


> Interesting hypothesis, but my gu has never gone down in the winter.


That's very interesting.


----------



## Debita (Apr 13, 2020)

So - just a little report on the Vit B complex.... It has very little effect on Skully's tail so far. Maybe starting to flake a little more. I'm going to continue it, hoping it just takes some time. Funny thing is, my female - Captain - who had no sign of even thinking about shedding was also given the supplement....and released a beautiful Tegu jumpsuit. Best shed ever.


----------



## Walter1 (Apr 13, 2020)

Debita said:


> So - just a little report on the Vit B complex.... It has very little effect on Skully's tail so far. Maybe starting to flake a little more. I'm going to continue it, hoping it just takes some time. Funny thing is, my female - Captain - who had no sign of even thinking about shedding was also given the supplement....and released a beautiful Tegu jumpsuit. Best shed ever.


Oh, wow.


----------



## Godzilla Earth (Apr 14, 2020)

hmm, I'm gonna assume that it fixs it a little at a time.


----------

