# Is MBD treatable in B/W's ?



## dragonqueen4 (Mar 22, 2009)

My 18" B/W Tegu gets calcium shots every few days, however, its been about a month now and his/her toes still twitch and tremor, has no energy, hardly eats, and is not growing. Has anyone gone through this before and know if in time it will reverse?


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## omgtaylorg (Mar 22, 2009)

The damage that is done wont reverse from what ive been told, BUT MBD is deff treatable and wont progress to get worse with proper care...what UVB light are you using and how close can the tegu get to it? Also, get the tegu out in some natural sunlight daily if your weather allows it, the natural sunlight will stop those twiches guarenteed...nothing better than the real sun. MBD is very hard on tegus though, which goes along with the things you named about lack of energy and so on...its a tough disease but it can be treated...I suggest getting it in the sunlight asap. Keep us updated.


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## omgtaylorg (Mar 22, 2009)

The damage that is done wont reverse from what ive been told, BUT MBD is deff treatable and wont progress to get worse with proper care...what UVB light are you using and how close can the tegu get to it? Also, get the tegu out in some natural sunlight daily if your weather allows it, the natural sunlight will stop those twiches guarenteed...nothing better than the real sun. MBD is very hard on tegus though, which goes along with the things you named about lack of energy and so on...its a tough disease but it can be treated...I suggest getting it in the sunlight asap. Keep us updated.


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## crimsonrazac (Mar 23, 2009)

Most young tegus can completly recover from mbd, as long as it is treated before it does to much damage.. If your tegu is older it may not recover but you can treat it still. If you have good weather take him outside into the sun. Make sure your lights give off UVB not just uva. If your UVB around 6 months old you might want to replace it. also make sure the bulb is the proper distance.

If any of my info is wrong please correct me. Hope that helps you, even just a little.


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## laurarfl (Mar 23, 2009)

It seems awfully strange that the calcium injections aren't relieving the twitching. If it is a calcium deficiency, the tremors and twitching arise from improper calcium balance interfering with proper muscle function and nerve impulse transmission.

OK, so off the top of my head...let's look at temps: are the temps set right for proper metabolism? If a cold-blooded animal is too cold, then nothing is going to work right anyway. 

Next lighting: Do you have a high quality UV bulb that produces both UVA and UVB? Is it placed at an appropriate distance with no filtering fine mesh screens or glass/plastic or whatever? Like it was previously stated, natural sunlight is best, but it may be too cold where you are. I would look into getting a mercury vapor bulb and placing it at the recommended distance.

Last but not least: diet. I thought I read in a previous post that you were feeding insects and gizzards and such. All of these foods are low in calcium, throwing the calcium phosphorous ratio out of whack. They will just perpetuate the problem. Dust all insects at each feeding with a supplement of calcium WITH NO PHOSPHOROUS. It is very important that it contains no phosphorous. The kind of supplement that has everything all mixed together will probably not serve your tegu very well at this point. Look for something like Rep-Cal without phosphorous. Also supplement with Herp-vite multivitamins just in case there is a B vitamin deficiency that could also be causing the tremors and lack of appetite. If he won't eat his usual food, buy some beef or chicken baby food and sprinkle some vitamins on a spoonful of food. Then he can kind of slurp it up. If you are going to vet regularly, he can check for dehydration as well...a dehydrated animal will also lose its appetite. I know Vitamin D can be controversial because of the risk of toxicity, but talk to your vet and see if it would be a good idea in this case. Perhaps the dietary D will assist the calcium.

If the MBD is in the early stages, then they most certainly can recover. It all depends on how far it has progressed and how quickly the husbandry issues are corrected. If any bony deformities are present they will not heal, but will keep their shape (tail kinks, curved legs, etc).

Best wishes and do keep us posted.


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## dragonqueen4 (Mar 23, 2009)

Thanks guys.
Everything is correct in his tank, basking spot of 105, ubv 10.0 about 9-10 inches away. 
The results from his bloodwork just came back and it turns out its not MBD. His calcium levels are high, yet the twitching is still there..which doesnt make sense. His kidney and liver came back as fine.
This means there is another problem, the vet is not sure what it is yet. Maybe viral? He didnt say what it could be, just that it could be something treatable or something not treatable. Does anyone know what could cause a tegu to have no energy and have muscle tremors other than MBD? Im really worried him


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## laurarfl (Mar 23, 2009)

Hmmm...if it's not calcium, then the only other thing I could think of would be a B vitamin deficiency like thiamin or biotin. Thiaminase (which breaks down thiamin) is present in frozen foods and fish, but I'm not sure how much would present a problem. Do you feed a lot of fish to your tegu? If so, removing the fish and supplementing with B vitamins should help.

Similarly, another diet related deficiency would be biotin because of the avidin in eggs. I've read that it takes an awful lot of eggs (almost 100% diet) to induce that sort of deficiency.

One last thing...could there be any chemicals that your tegu has been in contact with? Organophosphates found in bug sprays, well just about any pesticides, and fertilizers have neurological effects on animals and perhaps a very little bit has gotten into the substrate or the food or water.

Oh, and I guess all the blood glucose measurements were in the normal range (no hypoglycemia from a high protein diet?), and no obvious kidney damage?

Any chance of snake mites getting around your tegu and possibly carry some kind or germ?

I'm not a vet, but have a 4year degree in physiology and some animal science thrown in for good measure.  I'm just hoping that by talking "out loud" and tossing some ideas around, people will chime in and maybe something will pop up.


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## dragonqueen4 (Mar 23, 2009)

Thanks so much for your help. 
I have never fed him any eggs or fish. 
I have had him now for about 3 or 4 months and I have noticed slight twitching from the day I bought him and it keeps getting worse. The vet said there was no kidney damage. 
I have other reptiles, but havent had a problem with mites and he hasnt come into any contact with any pesticides. Its been getting worse for months now, and hes not growing at all like a young tegu should. 
I was using coil lights for his uvb and just found out that they are useless, so I bought him a new tube uvb light tonight. Im going to see if that makes any differnce at all. 
Thanks so much for your ideas, I will pass it all along to my vet. Any help is appreciated


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