New Sumatran Water Monitor

[james.w]

wow those are awesome.=] i didnt know the dumerils were so pretty.or was that the water? i cant wait till my tegus get that big.my biggest is my red tegu rosy,she is daddy's little girl haha. that is a nice cage for the blue tongue, i have a pair of blue tongues myself. the dog is cute too my grandpa used to have a dog that was was my favorite,it was part wolf and part German Shepard. thanks for taking the time to upload those pics.=] sorry if i was rambling i just woke up a little bit ago. and sorry to hear about your loss. my only pet i had die on me was my rosy boa that i had for like 5 years.=/

The pretty one I believe you are talking about is the Melinus.

 

[yulyani]

thank you for your kind words frost and james,....yes it was terrible to loss a pet,...but i think it is the reason we should be learning more and more about their husbandry and caring. The pretty one I believe is melinus,....it is tongky. She was soooo tame and she would like to approach me if I went home after working,....she would appear from her cave and climbing to hand. Water monitor i haven't posted the pictures,...I will later

 

[frost]

ahh cool,always nice to hear about people that manage to tame down there pets.

 

[Bntegus]

that water looks no different then any other import witch is fine but if you dont house it right your going to be just like the other 90% of import waters that die every year. and housing with the tegu is just stress full for both there young and water will not hydrate in the water tub they absorb though there skin they need substrate. and going bye what robin does is fine but you should see all the work he goes through for them. i have 4 large waters and i have problems all the time with them they are a lot of work please take the mean and nice advice just my 2-cents good luck.

 

[yulyani]

I post the pictures of salvators, because I think they have very different color pattern and even shape ( length and bulky ) sometimes I think they looked like different breeds of monitors.....tonny and ada are the the frogs and miut the 15 years http://www.tegutalk.com/images/smilies/smile.gifold doggy......

 

[frost]

woah those frogs are huge.great looking monitor too.

 

[yulyani]

woah those frogs are huge.great looking monitor too.

the frogs are about 2 years old.....

I love frogs very much.....

 

[james.w]

It's been two weeks since you first posted, how are things going with him?

 

[m3s4]

It's been two weeks since you first posted, how are things going with him?

Hey James - it's going just fine, thanks for asking.

I will admit however, it hasn't been an easy road. Food and feeding was a problem.

Meaning, he smashed the first 20 crickets I gave him then lost interest in them altogether. So, I tried:

meal worms
wax worms
eggs - raw, scrambled, poached, hard boiled
tuna
shrimp
salmon
crab meat
tilapia
monitor/tegu mix (just a generic pre-mixed monitor canned food)
more crickets
ultra-small pinkies
raw turkey

He took none of it except for the raw turkey. Interestingly enough, he was having a hard time swallowing the turkey - no matter what I did, it would get stuck to the roof of his mouth - just a size and shape issue that allows for sticky pieces of turkey to get stuck on the bridge of his upper mouth.

Anyways, nearly at my wits end...I said a prayer, (true story) more like several...and asked God to show me what I was doing wrong, or what I could do right since we were clearly both trying but getting minimal to no results.

The next day it hit me. I had a small, yet divine inspiration......I went to petsmart, asked for 10 minnows and then took them home. I dumped them into his water tub and left him alone. Came back an hour later and all the minnows were gone...He ate them ALL but I missed the process...Elated he ate of course, but a little bummed I missed it.

So, I went to the store the following day, got 10 more and waited - this time I got it all recorded on my phone...I watched him stalk every one of those minnows...He'd get right above them, slam his head down into the water, catch one then drag it up on his rock where he'd proceed to use it to manipulate the minnow in his mouth head first. When he achieved that, which wasn't that easy, he'd swallow it and then go after another and it's been rinse and repeat ever since...

He's putting on weight, devouring minnows and living a pretty good life right now. He spends 75% of his day just soaking in his tub - and eating. The rest is spent under a blanket and heating pad where he's usually found sleeping.

He's tame to the point I can handle him at will, is finally eating like a champ and is beginning to shed for the first time.

Long story short, tldnr - it's going quite well and all I can say to that is amen.

I have a video, but now that I know I can get better shots, I'll take a shorter version rather then the 8 minute one I have right now and then post the link.

******Just for future reference, in all the research I've done online, I have yet to see anyone mention using minnows or any type of live fish for their monitor babies...everything is cricket this and cricket that...well, not for mine. Chances are he'd eat anything small and aquatic; crabs, snails, small frogs, salamanders...it all makes perfect sense given their habitat. I just tried to follow everyone else's guidelines, and in my situation, none of it worked.******

 

[laurarfl]

You gotta watch the thiaminase is all. It makes perfect sense given the natural habitat.

 

[james.w]

Actually baby waters rarely go in the water. They spend most of their time in the trees. Give roaches a try. Good to hear he is doing well.

 

[m3s4]

Actually baby waters rarely go in the water. They spend most of their time in the trees. Give roaches a try. Good to hear he is doing well.

Thanks for the heads up laura, I'll be researching that condition thoroughly tonight.

James - it's interesting how much he loves the water. He'll sit in his tub all day...come out to bask...take a nap, wake up and hit the water again.

Roaches are right around the corner - problem is the ones I have access to are huge and way too big for him to take atm...so...as long as he's good with a selection of small fish, I'm good with it as well for the time being.

 

[james.w]

Could be because something is lacking in your husbandry.

 

[Bntegus]

that is great but you should still try pinkies everytime first they will not live on just fish. try to put any of the foods you are trying in the water and see if he eats it. my caiman lizards would only eat fish and shirmp and stuff i started putting pinkies in the water and now they love them.

 

[TegusRawsome80]

Agreed James.

 

[Grendel]

Get a fuzzy or a small hopper, he should attack it if it's running around.

 

[dragonmetalhead]

Your comment about the turkey getting stuck on the roof of his mouth intrigues me. Kodo has that same issue with softer pieces of raw meat. Watching him attempt to unstick it reminds me of a dog with peanut butter. I think it gets impaled on their upper teeth. Does this happen with anyone else's tegu/monitor/big carnivorous lizard?

 

[james.w]

Get a fuzzy or a small hopper, he should attack it if it's running around.

Definitely

 

[yulyani]

You gotta watch the thiaminase is all. It makes perfect sense given the natural habitat.

Dear Laura,

my tegu Gogon and my salvator MJ are very fond of living Goldfish...do I need to worry about thiaminase still if we give only the live fish ?.....thank you Laura

 

[laurarfl]

The data on thiaminase content comes from various sources, mostly from the National research council (1982), Deutsch & Hasler (1943), Greig & Gnaedinger (1971) and Hilker & Peter (1966); see also the literature list at the end of the article. The lists are far from complete, but most of the usually marketed and so far examined species are enlisted. Although primarily based on coldwater food fish and invertebrates, thiaminase content information exists for several tropical species widely marketed, and these been included accordingly.
Species that contain thiaminase

Freshwater fish
Family Cyprinidae (Minnows or carps):
Common bream (Abramis brama)
Central stoneroller (Campostoma anomalum)
Goldfish (Carassius auratus)
Common carp (Cyprinus carpio)
Emerald shiner (Notropis atherinoides)
Spottail shiner (Notropis hudsonius)
Rosy red, Fathead minnow (Pimephales promelas)
Olive barb (Puntius sarana)

Family Salmonidae (Salmonids):
Lake whitefish (Coregonus clupeaformis)
Round whitefish (Prosopium cylindraceum)

Family Catostomidae (Suckers):
White sucker (Catostomus commersonii)
Bigmouth buffalo (Ictiobus cyprinellus)

Family Ictaluridae (North American freshwater catfishes):
Brown bullhead catfish (Ameiurus nebulosus)
Channel catfish (Ictalurus punctatus)

Other families:
Bowfin (Amia calva) - family Amiidae (Bowfins)
Burbot (Lota lota) - family Lotidae (Hakes and burbots)
White bass (Morone chrysops) - family Moronidae (Temperate basses)
Rainbow smelt (Osmerus mordax) - family Osmeridae (Smelts)
Loach, Weatherfish (Misgurnus sp.) - family Cobitidae (Loaches)

Brackish (freshwater to marine) fish

Family Clupeidae (Herrings):
Alewife (Alosa pseudoharengus)
Gizzard Shad (Dorosoma cepedianum)

Other families:
Sea lamprey (Petromyzon marinus) - family Petromyzontidae (Lampreys)
Fourhorn Sculpin (Triglopsis quadricornis) - family Cottidae (Sculpins)
Salmon (sp. indet., processed and salted, probably Oncorhynchus sp.) - family Salmonidae (Salmonids)

Marine fish

Family Engraulidae (Anchovies):
Broad-striped anchovy (Anchoa hepsetus)
Californian anchovy (Engraulis mordax)
Goldspotted grenadier anchovy (Coilia dussumieri)

Family Clupeidae (Herrings):
Atlantic herring (Clupea harrengus)
Atlantik menhaden (Brevoortia tyrannus)
Gulf menhaden (Brevoortia patronus)
Razor belly sardine (Harengula jaguana)
Sauger (Harengula jaguana)

Family Scombridae (Mackerels, tunas, bonitos):
Chub mackerel (Scomber japonicus)
Skipjack tuna (Katsuwonus pelamis)
Yellowfin tuna (Neothunnus macropterus)

Family Lutjanidae (Snappers):
Green jobfish (Aprion virescens)
Ruby snapper (Etelis carbunculus)
Crimson jobfish (Pristipomoides filamentosus)

Family Carangidae (Jacks):
Giant trevally (Caranx ignobilis)
Doublespotted queenfish (Scomberoides lysan)
Bigeye scad (Selar crumenophthalmus)

Family Mullidae (Goatfishes):
Red Sea goatfish (Mulloidichthys auriflamma)
Yellowstripe goatfish (Mulloidichthys samoensis)
Manybar goatfish (Parupeneus multifasciatus)

Other families:
American butterfish (Peprilus triacanthus) - family Stromateidae (Butterfishes)
Southern ocellated moray (Gymnothorax ocellatus) - family Muraenidae (Moray eels)
Bonefish (Albula vulpes) - family Albulidae (Bonefishes)
Milkfish (Chanos chanos) - family Chanidae (Milkfish)
Common dolphinfish (Coryphaena hippurus) - family Coryphaenidae (Dolphinfishes)
Hawaiian flagtail (Kuhlia sandvicensis) - family Kuhliidae (Aholeholes)
Black cod (sp. indet.) - family Moridae (Morid cods)
Flathead mullet (Mugil cephalus) - family Mugilidae (Mullets)
Sixfinger threadfin (Polydactylus sexfilis) - family Polynemidae (Threadfins)
Regal parrot (Scarus dubius) - family Scaridae (Parrotfishes)
Swordfish (Xiphias gladius) - family Xiphiidae (Swordfish)

Invertebrates

Bivalves:
Ocean quahog (Artica islandica)
Clam (Tellina spp.)
Cherrystone, Chowder, Steamer clams (family Veneridae)
Pigtoe mussel (Pleurobema cordatum)
Scallop (Pecten grandis)
Hawaiian clam (sp. indet.; extremely high in thiaminase)
Blue mussel (Mytilus galloprovincialis)

Gastropods:
Limpet (Helcioniscus sp.)

Cephalopods:
Hawaiian flying squid (Nototodarus hawaiiensis)

Crustaceans:
Prawn, Tiger shrimp (Penaeus spp.)


"The flesh of this Brazilian ocellated moray Gymnothorax ocellatus contains thiaminase. Makes a better pet fish than food fish, anyway!"


Species that do not contain thiaminaseFreshwater fish

Family Centrarchidae (North American Sunfishes):
Largemouth bass (Micropterus salmoides)
Northern rock bass (Ambloplites rupestris)
Northern smallmouth bass (Micropterus dolomieu)
Blue gill (Lepomis macrochirus)
Black crappie (Pomoxis nigromaculatus)
Pumpkinseed (Lepomis gibbosus)

Family Percidae (Perches):
Yellow perch (Perca flavescens)
Walleye (Sander vitreus)

Family Salmonidae (Salmonids):
Bloater (Coregonus hoyi)
Lake trout (Salvelinus namaycush)
Rainbow trout (Oncorhynchus mykiss)

Other families:
Ayu (Plecoglossus altivelis) - family Plecoglossidae (Ayu fish)
Longnose gar (Lepisosteus osseus) - family Lepisosteidae (Gars)
Northern Pike (Esox lucius) - family Esocidae (Pikes)

Brackish (freshwater to marine) fish
Family Salmonidae (Salmonids):
Cisco, Lake herring (Coregonus artedi)
Atlantic Salmon (Salmo salar)
Coho salmon (Oncorhynchus kisutch)
Sea trout (Salmo trutta)

Other families:
Common eel (Anguilla anguilla) - family Anguillidae (True eels)
Pond smelt (Hypomesus olidus) - family Osmeridae (Smelts)

Marine fish
Family Pleuronectidae (Righteye flounders):
Winter flounder (Pseudopleuronectes americanus)
Winter flounder, Lemon sole (Pseudopleuronectes americanus)
American plaice (Hippoglossoides platessoides)
Yellowtail flounder (Limanda ferruginea)
Atlantic halibut (Hippoglossus hippoglossus)
European plaice (Pleuronectes platessa)

Family Gadidae (Cods and haddocks)
Atlantic cod (Gadus morhua)
Haddock (Melanogrammus aeglefinus)
Saithe, Pollock (Pollachius spp.)

Family Sciaenidae (Drums or croakers):
Atlantic croaker (Micropogonias undulates)
Southern kingfish (Menticirrhus americanus)
Spot croaker (Leiostomus xanthurus)
Silver seatrout (Cynoscion nothus)
Sand weakfish (Cynoscion arenarius)

Family Carangidae (Jacks):
Greater amberjack (Seriola dumerilii)
Yellowtail scad (Atule mate)
Mackerel scad (Decapterus pinnulatus)

Family Labridae (Wrasses):
Cunner (Tautogolabrus adspersus)
Tautog (Tautoga onitis)

Family Scombridae (Mackerels, tunas, bonitos):
Atlantic mackerel (Scomber scombrus)
Kawakawa (Euthynnus affinis)

Other families:
Tusk (Brosme brosme) - family Lotidae (Hakes and burbots)
Largehead hairtail (Trichiurus lepturus) - family Trichiuridae (Cutlassfishes)
Piked dogfish (Squalus acanthias) - family Squalidae (Dogfish sharks)
Hake (Urophycis spp.) - family Phycidae (Phycid hakes)
Inshore lizardfish (Synodus foetens) - family Synodontidae (Lizardfishes)
Mullet (Mugil spp.) - family Mugilidae (Mullets)
Scup, Southern porgy (Stenotomus chrysops) - family Sparidae (Porgies)
Ocean perch, redfish (Sebastes marinus) - family Sebastidae (Rockfishes)
Black seabass (Centropristis striata) - family Serranidae (Sea basses and Groupers)
Hardhead sea catfish (Ariopsis felis) - family Ariidae (Sea catfishes)
Searobin (Prionotus spp.) - family Triglidae (Searobins)
Silver hake (Merluccius bilinearis) - family Merlucciidae (Merluccid hakes)
Eyestripe surgeonfish (Acanthurus dussumieri) - family Acanthuridae (Surgeonfishes)
Atlantic blue marlin (Makaira nigricans) - family Istiophoridae (Billfishes)
Blotcheye soldierfish (Myripristis berndti) - family Holocentridae (Squirrelfishes, soldierfishes)
Glasseye (Heteropriacanthus cruentatus) - family Priacanthidae (Bigeyes or catalufas)
Great barracuda (Sphyraena barracuda) - family Sphyraenidae (Barracudas)
Invertebrates
Bivalves:
Cockle (Cardium spp.)

Crustaceans:
Marine shrimps (sp. indet.; Hawaii)
Portuguese crabs (sp. indet.)

Cephalopods:
Brief squid, calmar (Lolliguncula brevis)